"Talent Acquisition is an old-school mindset" — Upwork's Dr. Kelly Monahan

Welcome to the second edition of Monday Mornings! This publication dives into the new world of work beyond the 9-5, exploring the rise of mass entrepreneurialism. Through sharp analysis and interviews with the builders, thinkers, and leaders driving this shift, we’ll unpack what a post 9-5 world means for individuals, businesses, and society.

This edition is a Q&A Interview, where an expert guest offers their take on the future of work alongside our signature Monday Marvels and Monday Moanings.

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Happy Monday, folks!

This week, I’m talking to Dr. Kelly Monahan.

Kelly is a Managing Director at Upwork, the global talent marketplace for skilled workers. Kelly built and leads their future of work research programme, the Upwork Research Institute. Kelly is an author and speaker and has had research recognised and published in MIT Sloan Management Review, Harvard Business Review, and the Journal of Strategic Management.

I asked Kelly:

• How much progress have organisations made towards the new world of work?

• What gets in the way of leaders adopting progress, and, who has more power: the organisations or the employees?

• Is the future of work freelance?

Read on to find out what she had to say!

Q: Kelly, welcome to Monday Mornings! What interests you about discussing a post 9-5 world?

A: Much of our current workforce practices stem from a time—the 1920s and 1930s—when the economy and work itself looked entirely different. Back then, the structure made sense for an industrial economy and factory work. Today, the world has shifted so dramatically, and holding onto those practices is actually failing us.

Whilst we have more perks than ever at work today, engagement levels are at an all-time low; having deteriorated for the past 30 years. That’s why I’m excited to move beyond that.

At Upwork our research is guided by our ‘Work Innovator Framework’ which includes: i) emerging technology/AI, ii)  remote/flexible working arrangements iii) the move away from the full-time employee model. Our surveys are telling us that workers today need greater control over their working lives, their mental and emotional wellbeing, and flexibility to live the life they want.

That’s why the 9-5 is in decline. It’s not just amongst the younger generations either - we’re seeing Baby Boomers and Gen X choosing to work for themselves too and deciding how to structure and organise their work. 

Q: On that basis, do you think organisations have created the conditions where people would prefer to be self-employed?

A: Unfortunately, we see many leaders today still clinging to outdated approaches rooted in these 1920s paradigms. Meanwhile, societal metrics show a continued mistrust in business and government today: a majority of Gen Z are unsure business is doing more good than harm, and believe that business is failing us. 

One of the reasons I think leaders struggle with adapting is they are so tired. We talk a lot about the workforce being burned out, but I have never seen leadership burnout like this. We got so human at work because of the pandemic and it forced all of us to work differently overnight, but there was no ramp-up period and leaders weren't equipped for that moment. It created a strong, emotional burden for many leaders – and we’re seeing in the data many leaders choosing to opt out of full time employment, too.

Too many leaders today are going to fall behind. But there is an alternative – one where business incentives are aligned to operate on behalf of people, the planet and society. That’s what stakeholder capitalism is all about; it emphasises the need for businesses to create value not just for shareholders, but for all stakeholders—which includes employees, customers, communities, and the planet. There is also a real economic incentive for companies to get this right – if you look at the S&P 500 today, the average lifespan of a company is 15 years. That was 67 years in the 1940s.

Some companies are getting this right, like we’ve seen Unilever and Mars completely move the dialogue away from profit maximising and towards optimising. Unilever has even stopped quarterly shareholder earnings reporting. This is a strong model that could be adopted (and a lot of Gen Z are calling out for) but unfortunately, we’ve lost a lot of the focus around shareholder capitalism since the pandemic.

We wrote our book Essential to help leaders adapt to shifting workforce attitudes - we took a step back to realise there is no playbook for leaders today.

If you got an MBA you learned how to do business administration but probably not psychology. You definitely didn't learn how to actually motivate and influence people and understand their needs at work. 

Q: You’ve mentioned in your book one of the biggest future of work shifts is the move towards an independent workforce. But how much are organisations really open to hiring non-full time employees?

A: We looked into this at the Upwork Research Institute last year. I asked a simple question to over 1500 Executives; “What is the first word that comes to mind when you think of a freelancer?” The results were both shocking and heartbreaking. C-suite leaders around the globe by their majority responded with phrases like “cheap”, “gig worker”, “not skilled”, “transactional” and even “lazy”.

The challenge is many business leaders have an outdated model from the 1980s and 90s when it comes to freelancers or contractors. Back then, there weren't really highly skilled freelancers. Today, the term freelancers is such a nuanced market but we have grouped together an umbrella of terms from outsourcing, to managed services, to gig economy workers like Uber drivers. It’s this whole classification of basically “other”.

But this resistance isn’t serving these organisations when it comes to their longer term survival. Building up a really big full-time employee base is expensive and it actually isn't that agile. The one thing we know to be true about freelancers is that they are upskilling at faster rates than full-time employees.

It says something that the high-performing organisations had a completely different list to describe freelancers: they use “creative”, “innovative”, “fast”, “agile”, “skilled” and they showed a profound mindset difference amongst leaders in terms of how they are approaching freelancers.

Q: What should organisations do if they want to be the employer of choice for talent (freelance or full time)?  

A: A profound shift that HR has to make is to move from a Talent Acquisition to a Talent Access mindset.

One of my colleagues, Tony Buffum, uses this framework to show why ‘Talent Acquisition’ is an old-school mindset; the idea of acquiring somebody. It’s one that says, “I'm an employer, you're my employee, and I expect 120% from you all the time. Also, if you have extra capacity to give, you need to give it back to me”. 

Now, that did work when the social contract was strong and there was a two-way relationship; back when organisations were surviving beyond 60 years and were able to offer lifetime employment and paternalistic programmes and policies.

But that’s no longer the case and so today we need Talent Access, which says: “I'm going to access your skills and your time and pay you for that - whether that's in a full-time role or some kind fixed term contract. And I'm going to access that talent from you when I need it.” Then you might go and provide that to someone else, and that's fine.

What this does is it moves from a scarcity to an abundant mindset. One where skills are no longer scarce but are actually in abundance because we're accessing them and not acquiring them. 

When it comes to power dynamics and the question of who has more power - the worker or employer - we get mixed signals because we haven't made that full shift to talent access yet. I think when we do, there's going to be more balanced power because the markets will be able to play out: those in demand will be able to get hired and also have the flexibility they need.

We found in our research that when it comes to emerging skills, freelancers tend to be ahead, especially for the most in demand skills like AI. So talent access is going to become a business imperative for many organisations given the talent that's rising up across the board, outside of the West too -  places like India, China and Asia. 

Q: So, with all this in mind, what’s your prediction… does the future look brighter for employees or for freelancers?

A: Looking at the future of the workforce, we have to consider the impact of AI, which is disruptive to freelance and full-time workers alike.

At Upwork we try to make sure that we are guiding freelancers to the right careers, and we have seen that the people who are actually making AI today (those who are building it), are increasing in demand and in wages more than we've ever seen on our platform. At the same time, those doing lower skilled work, which is more routine and more easily commoditised in nature, they are finding AI to become a substitute for doing parts of their work. And with leaders so anxious to get costs out of the business and to become more efficient, that becomes a clear lever to pull. 

I know many workers have had to go through continuous upskilling and reskilling before, whether that's been due to cloud computing, robotic process automation etc. It isn’t a secret that AI will be just as disruptive.

So the future will test our resilience as workers, and it's all of our responsibilities as workers to continue to stay ahead of that curve –  this shouldn’t be catching anyone by surprise. I think this age demands ‘antifragility’ from workers. To be antifragile means when there's hardship that you actually become different, you innovate and become resilient. 

I do worry about the full-time employee population here more so than I do freelancers. There has been this ‘wait-and-see’ mentality from employees who feel it's their employer's responsibility to upskill them and make them aware of the changes that are coming. That is where I think certain organisations' paternalistic policies and programmes have done people a disservice. We have not allowed workers to become antifragile.

That’s why, if you're an entrepreneur or freelancer, you're ahead of the game today. You've never been dependent on any system – you’ve been antifragile.

I do think the future of work is freelance.

Q: We need antifragility more than ever in today’s world. Finally, what other advice do you have for people in the post 9-5 world?

A: Whichever form of work you are in, now is the time to double down and ensure that you're picking a skills pathway that's going to continue to provide value in the age of AI. At the Upwork Research Institute we’re producing a lot of data about the top skills that are in demand and how to upskill. 

If you are in a full-time job today, make sure that you're not just getting comfortable, but you're continuing to take courses and then apply them. Whether that's through a side hobby or trading via a freelancer platform like Upwork, or for your friends and family.  What I’ve seen oftentimes missing is we're giving people ‘coursework’ but it hasn't necessarily translated to the way that they're working and operating. We need to learn how to learn. 

I implore individuals to take control of their own career. Don't wait for someone to show you the pathway here.

Remember how many organisations are getting left behind (just look at those S&P 500 statistics) - many might not be surviving this next wave.

To find out more about Kelly and her team’s research, visit Upwork’s Research Institute, Kelly’s latest book Essential (coauthored with Dr Christie Smith) and connect with Kelly on LinkedIn.

I’d love to hear your thoughts on today’s interview. What else do you think should be considered? Share your opinions in the comments!

And, in other news this month…

👍Monday Marvels  

YouTube has caught the UK government’s attention with its call for better creator support systems. A survey to raise awareness demonstrates how over 15,000 UK-based YouTubers and partners are employers in their own right, yet face challenges accessing certain financial products and business building support.

👎 Monday Moaning

There is a hidden health cost to automation. Research from Vienna University of Economics and Business found a correlation between a workplace’s levels of automation and use of robotics, with poor worker mental health. It reveals the dark side of effects of automation which should "not be ignored by policymakers".

I hope you enjoyed learning from Kelly as much as I did! Stay tuned for two weeks from now with our next Briefing spotlighting women’s experience in the future of work.

Monday Mornings is written and hosted by Ellen Donnelly, a writer, speaker, and coach focused on the future of work. She specialises in the shift towards mass entrepreneurialism, and supports founders navigating pivots in her private coaching practice, The Ask.